Sarah Cuddy -- Once Again! Insights and Reflection on Leadership

[This is the “One of Our Own” feature that originally appeared in the 2024 Summer Issue of Two More Chains.]

Sarah Cuddy was the first person to be featured as a “One of Our Own” in the very first issue of Two More Chains in the spring of 2011. In that issue we highlighted her leadership role in providing medical care and emergency evacuation to a severely injured firefighter in remote wilderness on the 2010 Pyramid Butte Fire—as a first-year hotshot!

Thirteen years later, in this issue of Two More Chains, Sarah’s actions on the Pyramid Butte Fire still serve as an example of how we can best respond to critical incidents.

We tracked Sarah down. She is now a regional coordinator for Oregon State University’s Outdoor School Program. We figured she would have some valuable insights on “unplanned leadership moments.” We weren’t wrong.

Since leaving the fire workforce, Sarah has gone on to undertake and accomplish such a wide range of important and inspirational work.

In this conversation with Travis Dotson, Analyst for the Wildland Fire Lessons Learned Center, you’ll learn about Sarah’s significant insights on developing positive leadership environments, preparing for unplanned leadership moments, leadership roles and models, and empowerment.

Sarah Cuddy on the 2010 Pyramid Butte Fire in the Mount Jefferson Wilderness on the Mount Hood National Forest in Oregon.

Travis – How did you get into fire?

Sarah – I grew up in Prineville, Oregon, where the U.S. Forest Service is a large employer. My dad worked for the Forest Service. My sister had worked in fire. It was a common thing to do in a small community where a hotshot crew was based. So, I had just grown up knowing a lot about fire and knowing it was a great summer option.

I graduated high school and started Guard School the next week. The first four years I was in fire, I viewed it as a unique summer job to help put me through college. Then, after college, it morphed into something more. [Sarah has a Master of Science degree in Education with an English Speakers of Other Languages (ESOL) concentration from Eastern Oregon University, and a Bachelor of Science degree in Environmental Science from the University of Oregon.]

I was in fire from 2004 to 2011. I started out on a handcrew, then moved to a BLM engine, and then, back to a Forest Service engine. In 2006, my third fire season, I started filling in with the Prineville Hotshot Crew and knew that being on the crew was something I wanted to work towards. I went on to become a crew member in 2010 and then a permanent senior on the crew in 2011.

When I left fire, it was to work for NOLS (National Outdoor Leadership School), which was another seasonal outdoor job. In my early 20s I was drawn to that seasonal lifestyle. Being in fire allowed me to travel and see the world in the winter.

I worked as a field instructor for NOLS for another five years, leading 30-day wilderness expeditions for youth all across the west.

I also worked as a lead instructor for NOLS Wilderness Medicine, teaching and managing 80-hour Wilderness First Responder courses and Wilderness First Aid courses in various national and international locations.

As I was approaching my 30s, I took my first desk job. I worked in conservation advocacy for a bit helping to protect our public lands. And then, about six years ago, I transitioned into my current job. Based in Baker City, Oregon, I’m the Eastern Regional Coordinator for Oregon State University’s Outdoor School Program, that funds and supports outdoor education for fifth and sixth graders.

Travis – Wow, that’s so cool. And it’s great that you have that background with NOLS and specifically about leadership. The theme for this issue of Two More Chains focuses on when firefighters find themselves in an instance where they weren’t planning to be the leader, but all of a sudden, they’re faced with big decisions because of unexpected and unplanned circumstances. We can prepare people even though we know we can’t fully plan for it.

That leads to my second question: Looking back at your time in fire in general, what was your experience concerning the leadership environment and that whole independent action kind of idea?

Sarah with fellow Prineville IHC member, Joe Madden. Looking back today, Sarah says her time on Prineville instilled a sense of ownership and responsibility as well as a strong work ethic that she continues to carry with her.

Sarah – My time on Prineville instilled a sense of ownership and responsibility, as well as a strong work ethic that I continue to carry today. We actively trained in decision-making for self and for crew, which I think gets at the concept of independent action. We trained around medical scenarios—detailed conversations were a part of every briefing. Thinking about the “What If?” scenarios really became normalized and routine. This was also a time in fire when I feel like there was less overall medical support.

My understanding is now there is more medical support and infrastructure to support crews in a more systemic way than there was during my time in fire. But I think because of that—less general medical support at that time—there was much more emphasis on crew self-sufficiency, especially in medical situations, which probably carries through to today.

Travis – Did you feel empowered?

Sarah – Yes, medically, I did feel like I had the ownership and empowerment to act in medical response situations. It’s not even just empowerment. It was more like an expectation. We had trained, there was a chain of command for what happens in an Incident Within an Incident.

I think that sense of ownership and accountability probably translated to other pieces of fireline tactics, and I felt engaged and valued as a crewmember. My sense of accountability to medical situations made it feel more like a leadership role. 

Sarah in the Wind River Mountains in Wyoming in 2014 while working for NOLS (National Outdoor Leadership School).

Travis – There is no gray area. If somebody’s bleeding, it’s your job.

Sarah – Exactly. And it felt a little bit more like designated leadership. In this unplanned situation, we’ve planned for you to become the leader versus: “Oh, no, I have to jump into this role I hadn't planned on!”

Travis – That makes sense.

What have you learned about unplanned leadership since you left fire?

Sarah – I think breaking down the notion that being a leader is only happening when you are in that designated leadership role, like the crew boss, or squad boss, or the EMT. I’ve learned to encourage the idea that we’re all engaging in various forms of leadership all the time. Whether that’s self-leadership, peer leadership, or “active followership”, or, occasionally, the designated leader. 

I’ve also learned a lot about the idea of active followership. So even if you’re not in any sort of specific or designated leadership role, you’re still engaged in decision-making. You’re engaged in role modeling. You’re engaged in what it means to listen, to respond, to ask questions, to ask for help. All of those things are important to developing a high performance.

I think the idea is that leadership exists and is necessary in all levels. Despite not being the crew boss or the squad boss or the EMT, you’re still engaging in leadership behavior.

The concept of “unplanned” means you are suddenly put into a role that you maybe hadn’t anticipated. And so, certainly, there are times when you are an active follower who is forced into a situation in which you are now the squad boss or the crew boss. And maybe that was unplanned. I felt like we trained for that during my time on the hotshot crew.

Travis – Yeah, on almost any crew there are people who are just along for the ride. They’re not paying attention. They’re not going to be able to step in and fill a void—even if it’s just momentarily—because they haven’t been paying attention. They’re like: "I don't know. I filled up the water and made sure the tools are sharp, so I did my thing."

Sarah – I think there’s a focus on self-leadership and designated leadership in fire. You make sure you’re not the last one to the buggy. You make sure you do your chores. You make sure to follow the direction of the designated leader.

But if you’re really paying attention to what your peers are doing and if you’re helping out, including asking questions and asking for help—then more of those other leadership roles, like active followership, can be normalized. You’re better able to step into a leadership role because you have a better understanding of what it entails through your consistent leadership engagement.

Sarah in southeast Utah, near Bears Ears National Monument, in 2016 while working
for NOLS.

Travis – Going back to Pyramid Butte, where was that on your medical response experience timeline?

Sarah – That was very early. I had just gotten my EMT earlier that winter. In that particular medical scenario, the benefit of experiential learning was invaluable. Talking about it is one thing. But developing the muscle memory to begin acting in the moments when your brain is overwhelmed was so valuable.

Even though I may be really locked-up in my head with nerves and anxiety, I’ve at least got this muscle memory to begin engaging. I think that is really important. Practice scenarios, that type of experiential training, is so crucial for being prepared to act under stress.

And when we’re talking about unplanned leadership, oftentimes that comes at a time of stress. Having normalized some actions that you can engage in while you are still overcoming your own stress response in your brain is helpful to begin action.

I also think that getting my EMT certification exposed me to training outside the agency and the value of fresh perspectives when it comes to training.

The partnership between various organizations can open your eyes to new ways of training and new ideas to bring back into your crew. When I did my EMT training, we performed these medical scenarios that included various forms of leadership that I thought were really valuable. And then when I was back on the crew, we embedded these aspects into our crew training in the spring.

Therefore, I think it can be helpful to include new perspectives and training with a different agency and incorporate this new learning into what’s going to work for your specific crew dynamics.

Travis – I like what you said about how you went out and got this experience and then you came back and it was incorporated into the crew. This goes back to that environment question: When somebody at the lower end of the organizational structure brings something valuable to your organization, are you going to say: “Yeah, bring it in." Have you created an environment that encourages that?

Sarah – Yes, totally. And that was important.

I would say with my role on Prineville, it was very much encouraged to get the training. And then when I did get the training, it was like: "Great, you are filling this really valuable role. What do you have to offer and how can we make this a part of the crew culture?"

In a way, it became a designated leadership role for me in my first year on the crew. That level of ownership and empowerment made me feel valued. And that probably trickled down in a positive and beneficial way to a lot of other things within our crew culture.

If I have this responsibility of medical support, I’m really paying attention to the radio, I’m really paying attention to where is the helispot, where’s the safety zone? There was a level of engagement as a first-year crewmember that felt atypical. 

Travis – A lot of fire folks are talking a lot about good people leaving wildland fire. It feels like we have a hard time with retention. What was that process like for you?

Sarah and her family in Oregon’s Eagle Cap Wilderness this August on a llama packing trip. From left to right: Quinn (5); Sarah; Maeve (2); Ethan; and Marco the llama.

Sarah – I think it was twofold.

For the most part, I think my time in fire had largely just run its course. I was ready to move on to another adventure or another challenge in new ways. And, honestly, it’s probably my EMT course that gave me this idea to begin with.

In some ways, getting this outside training exposed me to another compelling lifestyle. It planted the seed for a transition to NOLS. I was ready for a new challenge.

But I also felt like as I began to move into leadership roles within fire, there was a certain leadership style that was expected or prescribed.

And that style really didn't necessarily mesh with my personal leadership approach. I think I was attracted to NOLS for the complexity and nuance of their leadership model.

In fire, I felt like to truly be successful, I had to embody a specific leadership style that really just didn’t quite fit for me. I think, over time, had I chosen to stay in fire, I could have morphed that into a style that was still effective within that chain of command system.

But, looking back today, I’d say why I moved on from fire was largely because it was time and I was interested in pursuing a different leadership style that I didn't necessarily see a way forward with in fire.

Travis – I think we recognize that even if you’re not feeling pushed out, you might be pulled toward something that’s more inclusive. I hear this often and I see it. It feels like we’re almost one-dimensional in fire with a militaristic male-dominated view of leadership.

Sarah – Right.

Travis – We can operate in such a silo that we think: “That's what leadership looks like.” And what you’re saying is you go someplace else and they show you: "Oh no, it can look all kinds of different ways."

Sarah – I also think there’s receptiveness to different leadership models in fire. It probably varies from crew to crew. You tend to teach how you were taught. And so if you’re brought up in the fire world under a certain leadership model, then you are likely to embody that leadership style as you move up. The more other forms of leadership become instilled, the more likely change happens within fire.

Certainly, there are times for that mindset. But the concept of what it means to be actively engaged when not making decisions, that was really important to me.

Travis – I think there’s change. But I think we could improve that change by acknowledging some of these things and expand our view of what leadership looks like. It’s unfortunate that we lose people because, in part, they’re attracted to a more inclusive leadership style. And we could totally change that.

And there’s always this dilemma: "Okay, are you going to embrace this accepted style so that you can get into a position, so that you can do it differently?" But then, by embracing it and doing it the accepted way, you kind of reinforce its supremacy.

Sarah and her family on an outing this May near Hells Canyon Wilderness.

Sarah – Totally. And I think some of it is probably just seeing the quality of a team change. You have a higher performing team when everybody’s engaged in some sort of leadership model or position.

So, if people are able to see a team improve performance or witness a high-performing team that is using a different model, it can be so beneficial.

And some of that’s maybe just through training. Or maybe there’s some opportunities where they’re building teams in a short amount of time based on new models. This can open their perspective to what a high-performance team could be.

I think that existence of a hierarchical leadership structure, some of that is for a reason in the wildland fire context. And there’s ways to adapt the model to be a bit more inclusive.

Travis – Totally. And there’s efforts and acknowledgement. But it doesn’t happen as fast as we would like.

Sarah – Yes. We’re talking about institutional change—that’s like generations.

Travis – What advice would you give to someone who is just getting into wildland fire?

Sarah – Well, I do feel like being on a hotshot crew is a really unique opportunity. You are exposed to such a wide variety of opportunities to learn in a quick way. I learned so much during my time on the Prineville Hotshots, just for the sheer exposure to various scenarios.

If getting into wildland fire is an opportunity for someone, I would say: "Take it."

Among other pieces of advice, I would also say, find a leadership style that works for you. Practice leadership in every role. Don’t be afraid to ask for help. We’re not really trained to ask for help in the fire world.

I think breaking that down creates richer teams. This includes even when you’re in a leadership position, role modeling, not having all the answers and needing the team to be able to make these decisions.

Asking for help when you’re in a leadership role is really empowering to the rest of the team. It’s not necessarily proof of your inability to lead, as many may wrongly perceive this. Instead, I think this encourages team participation in a positive way.

So, yeah, join a hotshot crew. Find a leadership style that works for you.

And don’t be afraid to ask for help.

Travis – That’s great. Fantastic advice!